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	<title>Comments for An Exercise in Irrelevance</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/comments/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog</link>
	<description>Ramblings from Phil Lord&#039;s life</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 16 Dec 2011 09:11:15 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on The Pici Principle: What you should not say by Phil Lord</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2011/10/the-pici-principle-what-you-should-not-say/comment-page-1/#comment-71202</link>
		<dc:creator>Phil Lord</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Dec 2011 09:11:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1945#comment-71202</guid>
		<description>&quot;Realism&quot; moves backward and forward in its principles. It is often very hard to determine what those principles are, because they change rapidly over time, often without being explicit. So you will excuse me, if I turn the question around and ask instead what realist principle is it that you can use to say &quot;well, even though the experimental data says this, we are going to choose NOT to model it, because it is too complex&quot;? Realism elevates &quot;reality&quot; above all else, and this is not a sensible way of operating. As my post says, we need use cases also. 

The general antipathy toward using an appropriate level of simplification can be seen here however, in this quote from Barry Smith. As you know, I do not have a philosophical issue with &quot;realism&quot; in general -- I just don&#039;t care -- but with the particular strand of it that is inherent in BFO, which Barry pushes. 

&quot;I am beginning to suspect that for you everything is a simplification
(model) -- for me, functions are part of reality; they are not
simplifications; I am not interested in simplifications. &quot;

http://groups.google.com/group/bfo-discuss/msg/865e601864fbc2dc

I agree with you,though. Anyone can get tied up in overly complicated arguments about some minor point (I hold my hand up here). We need to work on strategies to get around this; I think many of these do and will come from software engineering, and in particular from the agile and decoupled methodologies, rather than the waterfall approach that realism suggests.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Realism&#8221; moves backward and forward in its principles. It is often very hard to determine what those principles are, because they change rapidly over time, often without being explicit. So you will excuse me, if I turn the question around and ask instead what realist principle is it that you can use to say &#8220;well, even though the experimental data says this, we are going to choose NOT to model it, because it is too complex&#8221;? Realism elevates &#8220;reality&#8221; above all else, and this is not a sensible way of operating. As my post says, we need use cases also. </p>
<p>The general antipathy toward using an appropriate level of simplification can be seen here however, in this quote from Barry Smith. As you know, I do not have a philosophical issue with &#8220;realism&#8221; in general &#8212; I just don&#8217;t care &#8212; but with the particular strand of it that is inherent in BFO, which Barry pushes. </p>
<p>&#8220;I am beginning to suspect that for you everything is a simplification
(model) &#8212; for me, functions are part of reality; they are not
simplifications; I am not interested in simplifications. &#8221;</p>
<p><a href="http://groups.google.com/group/bfo-discuss/msg/865e601864fbc2dc" rel="nofollow">http://groups.google.com/group/bfo-discuss/msg/865e601864fbc2dc</a></p>
<p>I agree with you,though. Anyone can get tied up in overly complicated arguments about some minor point (I hold my hand up here). We need to work on strategies to get around this; I think many of these do and will come from software engineering, and in particular from the agile and decoupled methodologies, rather than the waterfall approach that realism suggests.</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Pici Principle: What you should not say by dosumis</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2011/10/the-pici-principle-what-you-should-not-say/comment-page-1/#comment-71119</link>
		<dc:creator>dosumis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Dec 2011 15:14:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1945#comment-71119</guid>
		<description>&quot;In short, the pici principle encapsulates the idea that deciding what we should not model in an ontology is as important as what we should model. And this decision comes from use cases, not reality.&quot;

I agree completely, but what realist principle says you need to give something the most detailed classification you can come up with? It&#039;s not unheard of for conceptualists to get tied up in arguments about dependent continuants and their various flavours.  Whether you are a conceptualist or a realist, you&#039;re not using your time well if you spend most of it worrying about abstruse classification issues that are neither of interest to scientists nor useful for basic sanity checking.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;In short, the pici principle encapsulates the idea that deciding what we should not model in an ontology is as important as what we should model. And this decision comes from use cases, not reality.&#8221;</p>
<p>I agree completely, but what realist principle says you need to give something the most detailed classification you can come up with? It&#8217;s not unheard of for conceptualists to get tied up in arguments about dependent continuants and their various flavours.  Whether you are a conceptualist or a realist, you&#8217;re not using your time well if you spend most of it worrying about abstruse classification issues that are neither of interest to scientists nor useful for basic sanity checking.</p>
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		<title>Comment on June Tabor and the Oysterband by Phil Lord</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2011/11/june-tabor-and-the-oysterband/comment-page-1/#comment-69408</link>
		<dc:creator>Phil Lord</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Nov 2011 09:52:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1952#comment-69408</guid>
		<description>I never expected to get a reply from someone on this one! I did occur to me that it might be a monitor, but I have seen one before. Good idea.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I never expected to get a reply from someone on this one! I did occur to me that it might be a monitor, but I have seen one before. Good idea.</p>
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		<title>Comment on June Tabor and the Oysterband by Caz White</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2011/11/june-tabor-and-the-oysterband/comment-page-1/#comment-69405</link>
		<dc:creator>Caz White</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Nov 2011 09:24:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1952#comment-69405</guid>
		<description>Ray has been standing on a prototype silent monitor which works by transmitting vibrations through your bones. He says &quot;I use it mostly for bass and kick drum and it gives the sensation I&#039;m playing in front of a huge PA. Clever stuff and I love it, it&#039;ll be great in the studio too.&quot; It all began with Oysterband&#039;s drumer and sound engineer, Dil Davies and Tim Porter, inventing an entirely new form of silent monitoring for drummers which has been in production for a year or so and is selling to drummers - including some household names - all over the world, many of whom say they now wouldn&#039;t play without it. The plate for bass players is the next thing in the pipeline: http://www.porteranddavies.co.uk/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ray has been standing on a prototype silent monitor which works by transmitting vibrations through your bones. He says &#8220;I use it mostly for bass and kick drum and it gives the sensation I&#8217;m playing in front of a huge PA. Clever stuff and I love it, it&#8217;ll be great in the studio too.&#8221; It all began with Oysterband&#8217;s drumer and sound engineer, Dil Davies and Tim Porter, inventing an entirely new form of silent monitoring for drummers which has been in production for a year or so and is selling to drummers &#8211; including some household names &#8211; all over the world, many of whom say they now wouldn&#8217;t play without it. The plate for bass players is the next thing in the pipeline: <a href="http://www.porteranddavies.co.uk/" rel="nofollow">http://www.porteranddavies.co.uk/</a></p>
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		<title>Comment on The Pici Principle: What you should not say by Chris Mungall</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2011/10/the-pici-principle-what-you-should-not-say/comment-page-1/#comment-65629</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Mungall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Oct 2011 00:43:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1945#comment-65629</guid>
		<description>Interesting article, many good points.

I consider myself a pragmatic realist (I was recently taken to task by a realist for being a pragmatist, if I was forced to choose sides I would be on the side of the pragmatists).

I would say the problem here is &quot;realist overreach&quot; into the murky world of properties. Unlike with physical entities (isotopes, rats, pasta) or processes (radiation, fluorescence) we have a harder time pointing to things in order to resolve debates about what should go in our ontology or which distinctions to make. This leads to non-useful debates and analysis paralysis.

It&#039;s particularly hard to point to a disposition (In fact, I have a particular problem with dispositions being &quot;real&quot; - BFO asks me to believe there are an infinite number of real but unrealized and perhaps wildly improbable dispositions floating around me every second: my disposition to raise my right eyebrow in the manner of Roger Moore, rub my tummy, fart if you pull my left pinkie, quit my job and join the circus, sing an ABBA song in a comedy Slovenian accent, throw custard pies at presenters during the next ICBO).

Trying to assert dubious sub-categories of DependentContinuant in advance is not useful and a recipe for pointless discussion, because it&#039;s harder to use objective reality as a guide. A pragmatic approach would be to always model the physical entities and processes as named classes (taking a hardheaded ultra-realist approach - unicorns? NOT ON YOUR LIFE MATE; hallucinations/cheesy Athena posters of unicorns? SURE, KNOCK YOURSELF OUT, I DON&#039;T CARE. Sorry Robert &amp; Rob), and then to introduce properties where they are needed for modeling purposes (taking a hard-headed pragmatic approach - e.g. avoid weirdo classes that don&#039;t correspond to a term a normal scientist would use; introduce distinctions that give you the desired results to queries and inferences).

If distinctions such as disposition vs quality turn out to be important in the long run, then we infer them. For example, if this particular entity is always radiating then we can infer there&#039;s a &quot;quality&quot; there. If this particular entity periodically radiates contingent on presence of some input, then we infer there&#039;s a &quot;disposition&quot; lurking around. If I am singing an ABBA song right now, then I have the quality of singing an ABBA song (perhaps other qualities, such as being a terrible singer, and looking like a bit of an arse). If you always sing ABBA songs after drinking three pints of lager, then we can model this precisely as such (e.g. &quot;P(Phill-sings-ABBA&#124;&gt;=3 pints)=1&quot;), and, if we so choose, infer that this is a &quot;disposition&quot; (based on the &quot;if&quot; or &quot;P(X&#124;Y)&quot;). No need to argue about the category in advance. Focus on the important things (e.g. building a useful probabilistic model that predicts ontologists singing ABBA, so we are forewarned and can get out the pub).

Nothing could be more realist than this (at least according to my simplistic boneheaded sub-Newtonian can-you-point-at-it flavour of realism).

I would perhaps go further and relabel the ugly &quot;dependent continuant&quot; as &quot;abstract&quot;, &quot;property&quot; or &quot;reified relationship&quot;, but that&#039;s enough heresy for one day..

TL;DR - realism works in general but &quot;dependent continuant&quot;s are dubious with regards to their claims to carve reality at the joints.

Cheers
Chris</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting article, many good points.</p>
<p>I consider myself a pragmatic realist (I was recently taken to task by a realist for being a pragmatist, if I was forced to choose sides I would be on the side of the pragmatists).</p>
<p>I would say the problem here is &#8220;realist overreach&#8221; into the murky world of properties. Unlike with physical entities (isotopes, rats, pasta) or processes (radiation, fluorescence) we have a harder time pointing to things in order to resolve debates about what should go in our ontology or which distinctions to make. This leads to non-useful debates and analysis paralysis.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s particularly hard to point to a disposition (In fact, I have a particular problem with dispositions being &#8220;real&#8221; &#8211; BFO asks me to believe there are an infinite number of real but unrealized and perhaps wildly improbable dispositions floating around me every second: my disposition to raise my right eyebrow in the manner of Roger Moore, rub my tummy, fart if you pull my left pinkie, quit my job and join the circus, sing an ABBA song in a comedy Slovenian accent, throw custard pies at presenters during the next ICBO).</p>
<p>Trying to assert dubious sub-categories of DependentContinuant in advance is not useful and a recipe for pointless discussion, because it&#8217;s harder to use objective reality as a guide. A pragmatic approach would be to always model the physical entities and processes as named classes (taking a hardheaded ultra-realist approach &#8211; unicorns? NOT ON YOUR LIFE MATE; hallucinations/cheesy Athena posters of unicorns? SURE, KNOCK YOURSELF OUT, I DON&#8217;T CARE. Sorry Robert &amp; Rob), and then to introduce properties where they are needed for modeling purposes (taking a hard-headed pragmatic approach &#8211; e.g. avoid weirdo classes that don&#8217;t correspond to a term a normal scientist would use; introduce distinctions that give you the desired results to queries and inferences).</p>
<p>If distinctions such as disposition vs quality turn out to be important in the long run, then we infer them. For example, if this particular entity is always radiating then we can infer there&#8217;s a &#8220;quality&#8221; there. If this particular entity periodically radiates contingent on presence of some input, then we infer there&#8217;s a &#8220;disposition&#8221; lurking around. If I am singing an ABBA song right now, then I have the quality of singing an ABBA song (perhaps other qualities, such as being a terrible singer, and looking like a bit of an arse). If you always sing ABBA songs after drinking three pints of lager, then we can model this precisely as such (e.g. &#8220;P(Phill-sings-ABBA|&gt;=3 pints)=1&#8243;), and, if we so choose, infer that this is a &#8220;disposition&#8221; (based on the &#8220;if&#8221; or &#8220;P(X|Y)&#8221;). No need to argue about the category in advance. Focus on the important things (e.g. building a useful probabilistic model that predicts ontologists singing ABBA, so we are forewarned and can get out the pub).</p>
<p>Nothing could be more realist than this (at least according to my simplistic boneheaded sub-Newtonian can-you-point-at-it flavour of realism).</p>
<p>I would perhaps go further and relabel the ugly &#8220;dependent continuant&#8221; as &#8220;abstract&#8221;, &#8220;property&#8221; or &#8220;reified relationship&#8221;, but that&#8217;s enough heresy for one day..</p>
<p>TL;DR &#8211; realism works in general but &#8220;dependent continuant&#8221;s are dubious with regards to their claims to carve reality at the joints.</p>
<p>Cheers
Chris</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Problem with DOIs by Karl Ward</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2011/02/the-problem-with-dois/comment-page-1/#comment-55781</link>
		<dc:creator>Karl Ward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Aug 2011 15:26:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1849#comment-55781</guid>
		<description>Phil,

I wanted to highlight the content negotiation work because I thought it might be useful to you.

Your question may be rhetorical but I must say that I don&#039;t understand the distinction that is made between URIs / DOIs and URIs / some other identifier scheme (for example, the accession numbers you refer to in the blog post).

What does one do with a DOI if it is not presented in the form of a URI? The answer is manually convert it into a URI using specific knowledge of the dx.doi.org service. But the same is true of accession numbers and the uniprot service, or any other identifier scheme and it&#039;s accompanying service(s).

I suppose if I&#039;m making a point, it is that identifier schemes and the services that support them are not separable. Knowledge of both components is required to make them useful. In that sense, I don&#039;t see how DOIs are different from any other identifier scheme, regardless how a user consumes them - as URIs or naked identifiers.

That said, it is surely better to present identifiers in a usable form, and CrossRef has now updated their DOI display guidelines to recommend the dx.doi.org form.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Phil,</p>
<p>I wanted to highlight the content negotiation work because I thought it might be useful to you.</p>
<p>Your question may be rhetorical but I must say that I don&#8217;t understand the distinction that is made between URIs / DOIs and URIs / some other identifier scheme (for example, the accession numbers you refer to in the blog post).</p>
<p>What does one do with a DOI if it is not presented in the form of a URI? The answer is manually convert it into a URI using specific knowledge of the dx.doi.org service. But the same is true of accession numbers and the uniprot service, or any other identifier scheme and it&#8217;s accompanying service(s).</p>
<p>I suppose if I&#8217;m making a point, it is that identifier schemes and the services that support them are not separable. Knowledge of both components is required to make them useful. In that sense, I don&#8217;t see how DOIs are different from any other identifier scheme, regardless how a user consumes them &#8211; as URIs or naked identifiers.</p>
<p>That said, it is surely better to present identifiers in a usable form, and CrossRef has now updated their DOI display guidelines to recommend the dx.doi.org form.</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Problem with DOIs by Phil Lord</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2011/02/the-problem-with-dois/comment-page-1/#comment-55763</link>
		<dc:creator>Phil Lord</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Aug 2011 13:04:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1849#comment-55763</guid>
		<description>Obviously this happened after we posted. I would say that a REST API would be nicer, because then I can cite a specific form of DOI. Still I agree that this is useful, and I might use it. 
But this still begs the question, that if the way that you make DOIs useful is by turning them into URIs, why not use a URI? 

Phil</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Obviously this happened after we posted. I would say that a REST API would be nicer, because then I can cite a specific form of DOI. Still I agree that this is useful, and I might use it. 
But this still begs the question, that if the way that you make DOIs useful is by turning them into URIs, why not use a URI? </p>
<p>Phil</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Problem with DOIs by Karl Ward</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2011/02/the-problem-with-dois/comment-page-1/#comment-55758</link>
		<dc:creator>Karl Ward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Aug 2011 12:47:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1849#comment-55758</guid>
		<description>In fact, dx.doi.org supports the same method of content negotiation for all DOIs. Each DOI registration agency must implement this functionality. CrossRef have done and it is hoped that other RAs will follow.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In fact, dx.doi.org supports the same method of content negotiation for all DOIs. Each DOI registration agency must implement this functionality. CrossRef have done and it is hoped that other RAs will follow.</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Problem with DOIs by Karl Ward</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2011/02/the-problem-with-dois/comment-page-1/#comment-55756</link>
		<dc:creator>Karl Ward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Aug 2011 12:43:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1849#comment-55756</guid>
		<description>dx.doi.org supports content negotiated requests for CrossRef DOIs:

$ curl -LH   &quot;Accept: application/rdf+xml&quot; &quot;http://dx.doi.org/10.1126/science.1157784&quot; 

$ curl -LH   &quot;Accept: text/turtle&quot; &quot;http://dx.doi.org/10.1126/science.1157784&quot;

These requests return representations of RDF graphs for the metadata of a DOI.

See the announcement here:

http://www.crossref.org/CrossTech/2011/04/content_negotiation_for_crossr.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>dx.doi.org supports content negotiated requests for CrossRef DOIs:</p>
<p>$ curl -LH   &#8220;Accept: application/rdf+xml&#8221; &#8220;http://dx.doi.org/10.1126/science.1157784&#8243; </p>
<p>$ curl -LH   &#8220;Accept: text/turtle&#8221; &#8220;http://dx.doi.org/10.1126/science.1157784&#8243;</p>
<p>These requests return representations of RDF graphs for the metadata of a DOI.</p>
<p>See the announcement here:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.crossref.org/CrossTech/2011/04/content_negotiation_for_crossr.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.crossref.org/CrossTech/2011/04/content_negotiation_for_crossr.html</a></p>
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		<title>Comment on The Naivete of Scientists by Bijan Parsia</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2011/06/the-naivete-of-scientists/comment-page-1/#comment-50402</link>
		<dc:creator>Bijan Parsia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Jul 2011 20:12:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1924#comment-50402</guid>
		<description>I call the current notion of open access (aka, pay to play) &quot;half-open access&quot;. Of course, this is true of the pay to read model as well. Yes, both models suck if you are on the paying end. In both cases, if institutional structures make the cost invisible (or indirect) for you, then hurray! Conference papers are, of course, pay everywhere, all the time, which really sucks.

I think the cost issues are hugely obviously overblown. Unis could all serve all scientific content in journals without much, if any, of a dent in their IT budget.

It&#039;s a scam. A horrible horrible scam. But half-open access just moves the scam around. At some point, google&#039;ll will crash that market, I expect.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I call the current notion of open access (aka, pay to play) &#8220;half-open access&#8221;. Of course, this is true of the pay to read model as well. Yes, both models suck if you are on the paying end. In both cases, if institutional structures make the cost invisible (or indirect) for you, then hurray! Conference papers are, of course, pay everywhere, all the time, which really sucks.</p>
<p>I think the cost issues are hugely obviously overblown. Unis could all serve all scientific content in journals without much, if any, of a dent in their IT budget.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s a scam. A horrible horrible scam. But half-open access just moves the scam around. At some point, google&#8217;ll will crash that market, I expect.</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Naivete of Scientists by Phil Lord</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2011/06/the-naivete-of-scientists/comment-page-1/#comment-50359</link>
		<dc:creator>Phil Lord</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Jul 2011 12:12:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1924#comment-50359</guid>
		<description>I am afraid you are right, the link is broken, but I will leave it in place for historical purposes (I actually wrote most of this article about a year ago, and have only just got around to publishing it!). 

Ironically, you can reach much of the content &lt;a href=&quot;http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2009/05/when_big_pharma_pays_a_publisher_to_publ.php&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;on this blog&lt;/a&gt;. You should also be able to reach the same content on &lt;a href=&quot;http://web.archive.org/web/20090505080002/http://www.the-scientist.com/templates/trackable/display/blog.jsp?type=blog&amp;o_url=blog/display/55671&amp;id=55671&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;archive.org&lt;/a&gt; but unfortunately the original was behind a registration wall, so the content has not been captured. This nicely demonstrates the problems that subscription (even free subscription!) based models have. 

I&#039;m afraid I don&#039;t have the wikipedia email -- it was on Nupedia-general I think, from Larry Sanger. I only archive my personal email. Nowadays I probably could archive all my email, because disk drives have got cheap, but this wasn&#039;t always the case.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am afraid you are right, the link is broken, but I will leave it in place for historical purposes (I actually wrote most of this article about a year ago, and have only just got around to publishing it!). </p>
<p>Ironically, you can reach much of the content <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2009/05/when_big_pharma_pays_a_publisher_to_publ.php" rel="nofollow">on this blog</a>. You should also be able to reach the same content on <a href="http://web.archive.org/web/20090505080002/http://www.the-scientist.com/templates/trackable/display/blog.jsp?type=blog&amp;o_url=blog/display/55671&amp;id=55671" rel="nofollow">archive.org</a> but unfortunately the original was behind a registration wall, so the content has not been captured. This nicely demonstrates the problems that subscription (even free subscription!) based models have. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m afraid I don&#8217;t have the wikipedia email &#8212; it was on Nupedia-general I think, from Larry Sanger. I only archive my personal email. Nowadays I probably could archive all my email, because disk drives have got cheap, but this wasn&#8217;t always the case.</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Naivete of Scientists by Duncan Hull</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2011/06/the-naivete-of-scientists/comment-page-1/#comment-50210</link>
		<dc:creator>Duncan Hull</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Jun 2011 17:47:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1924#comment-50210</guid>
		<description>hey phil, nice post. How did scientists end up paying so much for so little? Big journals bang on about &quot;branding&quot; - but the brand is often the expertise of the scientists on the editorial board. And a very expensive brand it can be too.

The link to the scientist article is broken...BTW

you should print out and frame what wikipedia email :-)

or blog it</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>hey phil, nice post. How did scientists end up paying so much for so little? Big journals bang on about &#8220;branding&#8221; &#8211; but the brand is often the expertise of the scientists on the editorial board. And a very expensive brand it can be too.</p>
<p>The link to the scientist article is broken&#8230;BTW</p>
<p>you should print out and frame what wikipedia email :-)</p>
<p>or blog it</p>
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		<title>Comment on Realism and Science by The Ontogenesis Knowledgeblog: Lightweight Semantic Publishing &#124; Knowledge Blog</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2010/07/realism-and-science/comment-page-1/#comment-45864</link>
		<dc:creator>The Ontogenesis Knowledgeblog: Lightweight Semantic Publishing &#124; Knowledge Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jun 2011 14:21:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1713#comment-45864</guid>
		<description>[...] Phillip Lord and Robert Stevens. Adding a little reality to building ontologies for biology, 2010. http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2010/07/realism-and-science/. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Phillip Lord and Robert Stevens. Adding a little reality to building ontologies for biology, 2010. <a href="http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2010/07/realism-and-science/" rel="nofollow">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2010/07/realism-and-science/</a>. [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Problem with DOIs by The Ontogenesis Knowledgeblog: Lightweight Semantic Publishing &#124; Knowledge Blog</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2011/02/the-problem-with-dois/comment-page-1/#comment-45863</link>
		<dc:creator>The Ontogenesis Knowledgeblog: Lightweight Semantic Publishing &#124; Knowledge Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jun 2011 14:21:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1849#comment-45863</guid>
		<description>[...] The problem with DOIs, 2011. http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2011/02/the-problem-with-dois/. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] The problem with DOIs, 2011. <a href="http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2011/02/the-problem-with-dois/" rel="nofollow">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2011/02/the-problem-with-dois/</a>. [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on Realism and Science by alexander garcia</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2010/07/realism-and-science/comment-page-1/#comment-40142</link>
		<dc:creator>alexander garcia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Apr 2011 03:35:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1713#comment-40142</guid>
		<description>True. Even worse, biomedical ontologies have grown in conceptual complexity with not real axiomatization or modularization. Realism has, as funny as it may seem, brought in a lot of simple and poor conceptualism. Some times I think these ontologies are soon to become a good example of &quot;too big to fail&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>True. Even worse, biomedical ontologies have grown in conceptual complexity with not real axiomatization or modularization. Realism has, as funny as it may seem, brought in a lot of simple and poor conceptualism. Some times I think these ontologies are soon to become a good example of &#8220;too big to fail&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Feedback on a failed JISC grant by Phil Lord</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2011/04/feedback-on-a-failed-jisc-grant/comment-page-1/#comment-37533</link>
		<dc:creator>Phil Lord</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Apr 2011 10:55:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1894#comment-37533</guid>
		<description>I said it was expected, not that I agree with it. To my mind, paying people is as good a way to generate content as providing a software environment enabling it. In this case, it was unlikely that the amount we were going to pay would, in practice, cover the author costs, but it seemed like a sensible way to get people to engage. 

The reviewers didn&#039;t think it was a good enough idea. Such is life.  

Phil</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I said it was expected, not that I agree with it. To my mind, paying people is as good a way to generate content as providing a software environment enabling it. In this case, it was unlikely that the amount we were going to pay would, in practice, cover the author costs, but it seemed like a sensible way to get people to engage. </p>
<p>The reviewers didn&#8217;t think it was a good enough idea. Such is life.  </p>
<p>Phil</p>
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		<title>Comment on Feedback on a failed JISC grant by Simon Harper</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2011/04/feedback-on-a-failed-jisc-grant/comment-page-1/#comment-37520</link>
		<dc:creator>Simon Harper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Apr 2011 09:19:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1894#comment-37520</guid>
		<description>The Comment -
&quot;The main criticism was more expected though, which essentially says &#039;it’s not crowd-sourcing if you pay people to develop content&#039;.&quot;

Seems a little strange to me - are we saying that Amazon Mechanical Turk isn&#039;t crowd-sourcing? Seems to be to me!

Si</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Comment -
&#8220;The main criticism was more expected though, which essentially says &#8216;it’s not crowd-sourcing if you pay people to develop content&#8217;.&#8221;</p>
<p>Seems a little strange to me &#8211; are we saying that Amazon Mechanical Turk isn&#8217;t crowd-sourcing? Seems to be to me!</p>
<p>Si</p>
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		<title>Comment on Realism and Science by Phil Lord</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2010/07/realism-and-science/comment-page-1/#comment-36802</link>
		<dc:creator>Phil Lord</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Mar 2011 12:39:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1713#comment-36802</guid>
		<description>My main worry with BFO and more with realism is that it is seen by some as &quot;correct&quot;. It is being touted as best practice for ontology building, when it really isn&#039;t. It is a compromise decision of a particular sort and, unfortunately, different circumstances require different compromises. So far &quot;realism&quot; seems to have resulted in ontologies getting larger, more complex and more confused, because &quot;realism&quot; suggests that if it is true &quot;in reality&quot; then you have to put it in the ontology. It&#039;s a recipe for analysis paralysis.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My main worry with BFO and more with realism is that it is seen by some as &#8220;correct&#8221;. It is being touted as best practice for ontology building, when it really isn&#8217;t. It is a compromise decision of a particular sort and, unfortunately, different circumstances require different compromises. So far &#8220;realism&#8221; seems to have resulted in ontologies getting larger, more complex and more confused, because &#8220;realism&#8221; suggests that if it is true &#8220;in reality&#8221; then you have to put it in the ontology. It&#8217;s a recipe for analysis paralysis.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Realism and Science by alexander garcia</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2010/07/realism-and-science/comment-page-1/#comment-36721</link>
		<dc:creator>alexander garcia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Mar 2011 17:39:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1713#comment-36721</guid>
		<description>I enjoyed your Plos paper and I fully agree with you. BFO has, IMHO, been confused by biologists with an ontology engineering methodology and also with a modularization method. Upper level ontologies like BFO are neither ontology engineering methodologies nor are they modularization methods. The confusion, and in general the influence of BFO in biomedical ontologies has lead to having mostly controlled vocabularies with very few axioms. Dont get me wrong, I dont have anything against controlled vocabularies, they are needed and also they are a necessary outcome when developing ontologies. Long live ontological pluralism!!!
 
Although abstracts, there are some engineering principles for developing ontologies. As a matter of fact there are several methodologies for developing ontologies. Most of them, if not all, follow in one way or another these principles. However, very few of them do mention the need for a singular “view” of the world, on the contrary, methodologies tend to embrace ontological pluralism. 

First design principle: “The conceptualization should be specified at the knowledge level without depending on a particular symbol-level encoding.”
Second design principle: “Since ontological commitment is based on the consistent use of the vocabulary, ontological commitment can be minimised by specifying the weakest theory and defining only those terms that are essential to the communication of knowledge consistent with the theory.”
Third design principle: “An ontology should communicate effectively the intended meaning of defined terms. Definitions should be objective. Definitions can be stated on formal axioms, and a complete definition (defined by necessary and sufficient conditions) is preferred over a partial definition. All definitions should be documented with natural language.”
Fourth principle: “An ontology should be coherent: that is, it should sanction inferences that are consistent with de definitions. […] If a sentence that can be inferred from the axioms contradicts a definition or example given informally, then the ontology is inconsistent.”
Noy and McGuinness’s first guideline: “The ontology should not contain all the possible
information about the domain: you do not need to specialise (or generalise) more than you need for your application.”
Noy and McGuinness’s second guideline: “subconcepts of a concept usually i) have
additional relations that the superconcetp does not have, or ii) restrictions different from these of superconcepts, or iii) participate indifferent relationships than supperconcepts. In other words, we introduce a new concept in the hierarchy usually only when there is something that we can say about this concept that we cannot say about the superconcept. As an exception, concepts in terminological hierarchies do not have to introduce new relations”.
Noy and McGuinness’s third guideline: “If a distinction is important in the domain and we
think of the objects with different values for the distinction as different kinds of objects, then we should create a new concept for the distinction”.
Noy and McGuinness’s fourth guideline: “A concept to which an individual instance belongs should not change often”.

As for the several definitions of ontologies I would say:
“An ontology is a non-necessarily complete, formal classification of types of information structured
by relationships defined by the vocabulary of the domain of knowledge and by the canonical
formulations of its theories”

Guarino and Smith heavily influence this definition. It complies with Guarino in that an
ontology is, possibly, an incomplete agreement about a conceptualisation and not a
specification of the conceptualisation. Ontologies should therefore be understood as
agreements amongst people within a community sharing interest in a common domain. By
“incomplete” it is understood that the classification of types of information should be left
open for interoperability purposes. By “formal” it is meant that the ontology specification can
be easily translated into a machine-readable code, as the ontology should support inference
processes within those information systems using it. However, it should be noted, that the
latter is not mandatory when defining ontologies on an abstract level.

More on this on my PhD thesis http://www.alexandergarcia.name/node/19</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I enjoyed your Plos paper and I fully agree with you. BFO has, IMHO, been confused by biologists with an ontology engineering methodology and also with a modularization method. Upper level ontologies like BFO are neither ontology engineering methodologies nor are they modularization methods. The confusion, and in general the influence of BFO in biomedical ontologies has lead to having mostly controlled vocabularies with very few axioms. Dont get me wrong, I dont have anything against controlled vocabularies, they are needed and also they are a necessary outcome when developing ontologies. Long live ontological pluralism!!!</p>
<p>Although abstracts, there are some engineering principles for developing ontologies. As a matter of fact there are several methodologies for developing ontologies. Most of them, if not all, follow in one way or another these principles. However, very few of them do mention the need for a singular “view” of the world, on the contrary, methodologies tend to embrace ontological pluralism. </p>
<p>First design principle: “The conceptualization should be specified at the knowledge level without depending on a particular symbol-level encoding.”
Second design principle: “Since ontological commitment is based on the consistent use of the vocabulary, ontological commitment can be minimised by specifying the weakest theory and defining only those terms that are essential to the communication of knowledge consistent with the theory.”
Third design principle: “An ontology should communicate effectively the intended meaning of defined terms. Definitions should be objective. Definitions can be stated on formal axioms, and a complete definition (defined by necessary and sufficient conditions) is preferred over a partial definition. All definitions should be documented with natural language.”
Fourth principle: “An ontology should be coherent: that is, it should sanction inferences that are consistent with de definitions. […] If a sentence that can be inferred from the axioms contradicts a definition or example given informally, then the ontology is inconsistent.”
Noy and McGuinness’s first guideline: “The ontology should not contain all the possible
information about the domain: you do not need to specialise (or generalise) more than you need for your application.”
Noy and McGuinness’s second guideline: “subconcepts of a concept usually i) have
additional relations that the superconcetp does not have, or ii) restrictions different from these of superconcepts, or iii) participate indifferent relationships than supperconcepts. In other words, we introduce a new concept in the hierarchy usually only when there is something that we can say about this concept that we cannot say about the superconcept. As an exception, concepts in terminological hierarchies do not have to introduce new relations”.
Noy and McGuinness’s third guideline: “If a distinction is important in the domain and we
think of the objects with different values for the distinction as different kinds of objects, then we should create a new concept for the distinction”.
Noy and McGuinness’s fourth guideline: “A concept to which an individual instance belongs should not change often”.</p>
<p>As for the several definitions of ontologies I would say:
“An ontology is a non-necessarily complete, formal classification of types of information structured
by relationships defined by the vocabulary of the domain of knowledge and by the canonical
formulations of its theories”</p>
<p>Guarino and Smith heavily influence this definition. It complies with Guarino in that an
ontology is, possibly, an incomplete agreement about a conceptualisation and not a
specification of the conceptualisation. Ontologies should therefore be understood as
agreements amongst people within a community sharing interest in a common domain. By
“incomplete” it is understood that the classification of types of information should be left
open for interoperability purposes. By “formal” it is meant that the ontology specification can
be easily translated into a machine-readable code, as the ontology should support inference
processes within those information systems using it. However, it should be noted, that the
latter is not mandatory when defining ontologies on an abstract level.</p>
<p>More on this on my PhD thesis <a href="http://www.alexandergarcia.name/node/19" rel="nofollow">http://www.alexandergarcia.name/node/19</a></p>
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		<title>Comment on Why Realism is Wrong by Ontological realism, methodologies, and mud slinging: a few notes on the AO trilogy &#171; Keet blog</title>
		<link>http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/2010/09/why-realism-is-wrong/comment-page-1/#comment-32865</link>
		<dc:creator>Ontological realism, methodologies, and mud slinging: a few notes on the AO trilogy &#171; Keet blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Feb 2011 08:02:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.russet.org.uk/blog/?p=1779#comment-32865</guid>
		<description>[...] can be read over at Phil Lord’s blog (The Status quo farewell tour on realism, Why not?, and Why realism is wrong) and his paper together with Robert Stevens at PLoS ONE [9], versus David Sutherland’s Realism, [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] can be read over at Phil Lord’s blog (The Status quo farewell tour on realism, Why not?, and Why realism is wrong) and his paper together with Robert Stevens at PLoS ONE [9], versus David Sutherland’s Realism, [...]</p>
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